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Tuesday, September 2, 2014

2008 Thread: Suns at Knicks 12/2/2007

Your in-game/post-game comments here.

I will be in attendance, so I hope it is not as bad as the Warriors game. At least I’ll be watching it from a corporate box! Woohoo!

21 comments on “2008 Thread: Suns at Knicks 12/2/2007

  1. Latke

    demetrius nichols got some burn for the cavs today. 0-3 in 3 minutes. 1 rebound, 1 turnover, zero points.

  2. jon abbey

    man, people take no enjoyment when the Knicks play “well”, huh? the ratio of posts here when they lose as opposed when they win seems very high.

  3. Joe

    to jon abbey: it’s absurd of you to rag on Knick fans for complaining louder after losses than cheering after wins. Why? Because smarter Knick fans know that any flashes of good play and heart that this teams shows are only that: FLASHES. They are unable to sustain hustle and general good energy for more than a 1 or 2 game stretch. And have you ever seen them blow out a team this year. No? You know why? It’s because they don’t have the basketball IQ and mental toughness to sustain good play for an entire 4 quarters. They’re losers, and they always will be. Sure, they’re capable of an occasional burst of energy and gutsy win (just like ANY team in the NBA), but that will immediately be offset by a mail-in performance.

    Give us a legitimate reason why we, as Knick fans, should get all giddy after a win or two? Why should we, when we know that another wretched performance is imminent? This loser-like pattern will not change until Isiah and Marbury are both jettisoned for good, and replaced by people with brains, honesty, talent, AND passion for the game (not the same as passion for a paycheck).

  4. jon abbey

    dude, read my post again, don’t vent on me. I’m just commenting that people seem a lot more eager to post when the team’s playing badly than when it’s playing well. I’m as frustrated as anyone, but that doesn’t mean it wasn’t fun to watch the first three quarters tonight. I guess you could root for them to lose every game until changes are made, but so many changes need to be made that you’re going to be rooting for losses for a long time to come.

    “This loser-like pattern will not change until Isiah and Marbury are both jettisoned for good, and replaced by people with brains, honesty, talent, AND passion for the game (not the same as passion for a paycheck).”

    no, it will not change until Dolan sells the team. that’s the underlying problem, Isiah and Marbury are merely symptoms.

  5. Joe

    Okay jon, my fault on the misread. I guess I disagree that they looked good for three quarters, because over the last 3 or 4 years they’ve often looked good for 3 quarters, and I’m sick of viewing that in any way as a positive.

    As for Dolan, I agree he’s the biggest problem. Where I disagree is that I believe it is possible for a different GM to turn this franchise around and make it successful. Isiah is the worst thing that happened to the Knicks (Marbury being a symptom of Isiah). If you have special insight into why, ab initio, any Knick GM will fail with Dolan in charge, then I’m all ears and eyes and will happily process your opinions. Short of that, I again assert there is no reason why a quality GM can’t succeed with the Knicks, who exhibits fiscal restraint when necessary, who isn’t in love with failed playground heroes like Marbury, Crawford, and Curry, who is actually interested in scouting the vast pool of talent in Europe, Asia, and South America, and who knows how to get rid of expiring contracts for draft picks instead more long-term dead weight. No, I’m afraid that Isiah is the real problem. Dolan, I believe, has ulterior motives (i.e. not for the good of the team) for keeping him around. Namely, the sexual harassment case (up for appeal) and the embarrassment of firing a coach to whom he very recently gave a lucrative four year extension.

  6. Joe

    Also, the best thing that could happen to the Knicks is for them to lose every single game until Isiah is fired. It’s no disgrace for a Knick fan to want them to lose, not with idiots like Isiah in charge. He’s just going to lead us to one 38 win season after another.

  7. jon abbey

    hey, anything’s possible, Ainge was a dreadful GM until he semi-lucked into the two deals this past offseason, and Cleveland’s last couple of GMs have been horrendous, but they lucked into LeBron in the draft, so they made the Finals last year.

    I just think that the only real way to fix a toxic organization like the Knicks have is from the top, like the Red Sox did with John Henry. would any Red Sox GM have failed under the previous ownership? not necessarily, but a new owner allowed them to get a fresh start, and that’s by far the best chance that NY has to become relevant again. well, that or LeBron taking pity on them in a few years when he’s a free agent.

  8. jon abbey

    “Also, the best thing that could happen to the Knicks is for them to lose every single game until Isiah is fired. It?s no disgrace for a Knick fan to want them to lose, not with idiots like Isiah in charge. He?s just going to lead us to one 38 win season after another. ”

    yeah, no problem with that whatsoever, I’ve been doing it myself to an extent. I don’t think that firing Isiah is going to do much good, though, our personnel problems are way too deeply rooted.

  9. cwod

    Dolan owns the Rangers, too, and they’ve been good for three straight seasons.

    Granted, that was after something like seven years of awfulness.

  10. TheMC5

    The Rangers also have one of the best GM’s in hockey, the man who engineered the Oilers 5 Stanley Cups: Glen Sather.

  11. TheMC5

    That’s true, cwad. But turning around a team in hockey generally takes at least a few years anyway, depending on how flawed the roster is, because 1 or 2 players don’t make anywhere the impact that they would in basketball (with the possible exception of goalies).

  12. Joe

    Jon: just one more thing to mention about Dolan. I don’t even bother hypothesizing about a change in ownership, since Charles Dolan has made it clear that he intends to keep his incompetent son in charge, and Jimmy boy doesn’t show any inclination to sell the team. I’m pretty sure we’re stuck with the Dolans. If that’s true, they have to rebuild first at the GM level.

  13. jon abbey

    well, you can root for them to go 8-74 season after season until he sells, whether they change GMs or coaches or not. to me, changing GMs and/or coaches is just putting a band-aid on a limb that needs to be amputated.

  14. Joe

    Jon: in your vision of the Knicks, they will forever be a failed franchise if JD is in charge, no matter who is GM. This may be the case, but all indications are that JD isn’t going anywhere. Given that, it doesn’t make any sense for fans to be complacent with Isiah as GM, since one thing we do know, which is not a matter of speculation, is that the James Dolan / Isiah Thomas combination one-two tagteam does not work. End of that story. It doesn’t make sense to leave the status quo in place, even if James Dolan is the main source of the problem. Something has to be change, and it has to be Isiah. I don’t see any way around that, and I am not convinced that booting him would be so entirely ineffectual.

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